Completion rating should be rolling 30 days not 60

[kholland65]

Until recently I was a level 2 seller. I spent a lot of time and worked hard building up to that rating. I’ve always gotten positive 5 star reviews. However, it now looks like because I was unfortunately enough to come across a string of dysfunctional clients, I’m going to get demoted to new seller.

Here is how the math works out:
I currently have an 81% rating, I’ve completed 17 of 21 orders.
For me to get back to 90% I would need to complete another 23 (40 of 44 completed) orders and do so in 30 days, which is not plausible in my line of work.
I was already demoted to level 1, and now it’s basically mathematically impossible for me not get downgraded again to new seller.

In my case not 1 of the 4 cancellations was my fault. In all cases the clients were clearly problematic and reported for their behavior. In 2 of the cases Customer Service was who had to intervene and cancel the order on my behalf. I’ve always otherwise had almost a nearly perfect completion rating in the year I’ve had my account. Until this point I had cancelled only 2 orders in the 100 or more I had completed. I merely got unlucky with having many bad clients all come in at once.

I don’t think it’s fair to penalize sellers in this way when many times the seller is not at fault. Sometimes a buyer places an order before realizing they don’t have the proper files needed. There are many situations where cancellations are not the sellers fault. In addition, the demotion system is mathematically rigged against you. Either all time cancellation needs to be additionally consider such as “90% completion rating over a 60 day period OR all time”, or the it needs to switch to a rolling 30 day period to fall in line with the evaluation period. As it stands now, low volume businesses have nearly no chance of ever getting back above the 90% threshold in the 30 days needed to avoid a double demotion because even 1 cancellation too many can hold a huge amount of weight on a percentage basis.

What ultimately makes me feel defeated in this whole situation is not only did I waste time and not earn money on problematic clients who were abusive to me, they have also done deeper damage by really taking a huge hit out of my future earnings and livelihood since it will now likely be about 3 months before my account can climb back up to a level 2.

Overall I think the mentality needs to change regarding cancellations. In my opinion cancellations are typically more indicative of a buyer issue, not a seller issue. First of all, if a seller was defrauding people, they wouldn’t last long before their account was merely weeded out by bad reviews and a lack of orders. Most sellers don’t willing try and defraud people as it would be against their best interest to do so. Additionally, mistakes are likely going to be made on the part of the buyer who is less familiar with the product/service and in most cases is not the experienced professional. Even in retail scenarios, most returns occur do to buyer mistakes, not defective products. Reasons like, “I changed my mind, it didn’t fit, I bought it by mistake, I found something different, etc.” are commonly used. In all cases this is of no fault to the seller. However fiverr’s policies always place all of the blame on the seller. Sellers are who truly earn money for fiverr, so I feel they need to be a bit more on our side when it comes to how they design the platform. This is an example of a positive change that would benefit sellers and the website as a whole.

[mariashtelle1]

Absolutely agree. This system annoys me so much (not even talking how emotionally draining it is to deal with this) but I also can see where fiver comes from. If you read this forum and amount of “advises certain seller give to each other to cancel the order right away if they think that buyer wouldn’t give them 5 star rating keeping buyers frustrated and fiverr without their commission)

However you can try to contact support team. They wouldn’t be able to restore your statistics but they can make some orders not to affect your evaluation
(E.g your statistics still can be below 90% but some orders in the system wouldn’t count as a downgrading and it wouldn’t make you loose your level)

But again there is no guarantee, once they did it for me, all other times they were arguing with me that they can not do it. So you can just try your luck, you have nothing to loose.
(It all depends on the support person that you will get, in fact I still have open ticket for more than a week for a PayPal chargeback and they still “looking into details” even though I sent them all evidence)

[dawalagiri]

You are 200% correct.

[miiila]

I fear switching from 60 to 30 days will just lead to the same issue for sellers in a similar situation like yours (gigs where you can’t fire out orders all the time) or for those who simply don’t get so many orders for a different reason. Be sick or need a vacation for part of those 30 days and then get one or several “buyers’ fault cancellations” during the remaining 30 days and you might be just as wet.

I however agree, as probably everyone does, that the system needs to be tweaked in a way that certain cancellation reasons (buyer ordered “accidentally”, changed their mind suddenly, etc.) won’t affect seller’s accounts.

From own experience and several forum posts, it does seem that support in fact sometimes cancels orders for sellers with “minimal impact” = no drop in completion rate.

I’m not sure why people seem to get different results when they ask support to cancel for them, whether it depends on specific criteria and circumstances or just on who deals with their case.

The system should be semi-automated lest it needs too much staff and thus money
(which ultimately would have to come out of sellers’ and buyers’ pockets via fee raises which none of us want either probably).
Like if both seller and buyer pick the same “valid” cancellation reason, e.g., “ordered accidentally”, it shouldn’t count, and if they pick reasons that don’t match, support should look into the case to see what’s up.

In case it’s really something that should be penalised (after all, abuse of the prior mutual cancellation without penalty system is what brought this new system upon us),
they could let that cancellation count against the seller then (or perhaps even against the buyer, if it turns out they regularly order “accidentally” or have sellers cancel on them often because of some kind of abusive behaviour).

Sadly, with how many users and gigs and probably cancellations there are per day, I guess even semi-automated, it would be a major cost factor that Fiverr doesn’t want, as I can’t see any other reason to penalize sellers for things that aren’t their fault.

I think a possible solution could come from more and well-briefed staff which is able to evaluate a “cancellation situation” quickly and appropriately in a fair semi-automated system, in combination with a stricter control of things like that users (both sellers and buyers) who abuse the system so often/gravely that they are suspended, won’t just sign up again, elimination of all multiple accounts and such.

Until they found a better solution, it would be nice if they “sent some smoke signs” to tell us if they are still aware of and working on the unfinished construction site that the new(er) mutual cancellation system we seem to be stuck with so far is, or to clearly state somewhere the cases in which cancellations will be done by support without affecting sellers’ rates, and make sure that all support staff is on the same page.

[ammarshrf]

Absolutely agree. This system annoys me so much (not even talking how emotionally draining it is to deal with this) but I also can see where fiver comes from. If you read this forum and amount of “advises certain seller give to each other to cancel the order right away if they think that buyer wouldn’t give them 5 star rating keeping buyers frustrated and fiverr without their commission)

However you can try to contact support team. They wouldn’t be able to restore your statistics but they can make some orders not to affect your evaluation

(E.g your statistics still can be below 90% but some orders in the system wouldn’t count as a downgrading and it wouldn’t make you loose your level)

But again there is no guarantee, once they did it for me, all other times they were arguing with me that they can not do it. So you can just try your luck, you have nothing to loose.

(It all depends on the support person that you will get, in fact I still have open ticket for more than a week for a PayPal chargeback and they still “looking into details” even though I sent them all evidence)

(It all depends on the support person that you will get, in fact I still have open ticket for more than a week for a PayPal chargeback and they still “looking into details” even though I sent them all evidence)

Mine has been opened for 13 days now…

And I too sent all evidence.

[hariswaheed1]

Strongly agree. But I would like to say one thing “Buyer is always right”. As buyers are paying sellers and Fiverr too so we should respect and fullfil their demands everytime 😊

[ammarshrf]

Strongly agree. But I would like to say one thing “Buyer is always right”. As buyers are paying sellers and Fiverr too so we should respect and fullfil their demands everytime 😊

I disagree, buyers are not always right.

[hariswaheed1]

I disagree, buyers are not always right.

Brother, if even buyer is wrong then you can’t do anything. Always try to fullfil the buyer’s demands even he is wrong. So that’s why I said “Buyer is always right”

[ammarshrf]

Brother, if even buyer is wrong then you can’t do anything. Always try to fullfil the buyer’s demands even he is wrong. So that’s why I said “Buyer is always right”

Wrong, buyers are not always right. In many cases I was right and CS took my side.

[hariswaheed1]

Wrong, buyers are not always right. In many cases I was right and CS took my side.

Ahan great! 😊

[ammarshrf]

Ahan great! 😊

I have several cases in the past.

One of them when buyer requested extra work and when I refused he started insulting my race, CS canceled the order and sent me a compensation of the order’s amount and his account was deactivated.

Another case, when a buyer requested from me to solve an equation he couldn’t figure out (with Excel) and when I solved it he claimed to have partially solved it with me, and wanted a refund, I refused and contacted CS and they refused his cancellation since i have done exactly what he asked.

There are more cases, but 2 examples are enough.

[hariswaheed1]

I have several cases in the past.

One of them when buyer requested extra work and when I refused he started insulting my race, CS canceled the order and sent me a compensation of the order’s amount and his account was deactivated.

Another case, when a buyer requested from me to solve an equation he couldn’t figure out (with Excel) and when I solved it he claimed to have partially solved it with me, and wanted a refund, I refused and contacted CS and they refused his cancellation since i have done exactly what he asked.

There are more cases, but 2 examples are enough.

Good to hear brother 😊

[kholland65]

I fear switching from 60 to 30 days will just lead to the same issue for sellers in a similar situation like yours (gigs where you can’t fire out orders all the time) or for those who simply don’t get so many orders for a different reason. Be sick or need a vacation for part of those 30 days and then get one or several “buyers’ fault cancellations” during the remaining 30 days and you might be just as wet.

I however agree, as probably everyone does, that the system needs to be tweaked in a way that certain cancellation reasons (buyer ordered “accidentally”, changed their mind suddenly, etc.) won’t affect seller’s accounts.

From own experience and several forum posts, it does seem that support in fact sometimes cancels orders for sellers with “minimal impact” = no drop in completion rate.

I’m not sure why people seem to get different results when they ask support to cancel for them, whether it depends on specific criteria and circumstances or just on who deals with their case.

The system should be semi-automated lest it needs too much staff and thus money

(which ultimately would have to come out of sellers’ and buyers’ pockets via fee raises which none of us want either probably).

Like if both seller and buyer pick the same “valid” cancellation reason, e.g., “ordered accidentally”, it shouldn’t count, and if they pick reasons that don’t match, support should look into the case to see what’s up.

In case it’s really something that should be penalised (after all, abuse of the prior mutual cancellation without penalty system is what brought this new system upon us),

they could let that cancellation count against the seller then (or perhaps even against the buyer, if it turns out they regularly order “accidentally” or have sellers cancel on them often because of some kind of abusive behaviour).

Sadly, with how many users and gigs and probably cancellations there are per day, I guess even semi-automated, it would be a major cost factor that Fiverr doesn’t want, as I can’t see any other reason to penalize sellers for things that aren’t their fault.

I think a possible solution could come from more and well-briefed staff which is able to evaluate a “cancellation situation” quickly and appropriately in a fair semi-automated system, in combination with a stricter control of things like that users (both sellers and buyers) who abuse the system so often/gravely that they are suspended, won’t just sign up again, elimination of all multiple accounts and such.

Until they found a better solution, it would be nice if they “sent some smoke signs” to tell us if they are still aware of and working on the unfinished construction site that the new(er) mutual cancellation system we seem to be stuck with so far is, or to clearly state somewhere the cases in which cancellations will be done by support without affecting sellers’ rates, and make sure that all support staff is on the same page.

The issue is the discrepancy between the rolling 60 day rating metric, and the 30 day evaluation period. It’s a guaranteed double demotion basically. No cancellations will get phased out before the 2nd evaluation, and as I stated before the math doesn’t work out in favor of a seller being able to dig themselves out of the ditch once they are in it. It’s a rigged system that guarantees you drop to new seller which doesn’t make any sense that such a severe penalty would be enacted.

Likely I’m going to contact support and ask they at least don’t count the 2 orders that customer service had to cancel on my behalf because of combative buyers who refused to work with and accept an order that was rendered as described. They took my side on those issues so I don’t see how I should be penalized for those. Having those 2 removed would put me back in good standing.

[kholland65]

Ahan great! 😊

Basically the 4 cancellation reasons that are currently impacting my rating are as follows:

1. Buyer placed and order, I delivered a high quality product as requested. Buyer immediately began insulting me and requesting a refund with providing an opportunity for me to do revisions. Just went behind my back and contacted support. Support cancelled the order but still paid me my money since they recognized I had completed the work as described.

2. Similar as above. Buyer placed and order. I communicated that there were issues with the files that would impact the final results. The buyer understand and insisted I move forward. I deliver what I feel is a good product. The buyer immediately gets combative, insulting, and asks for a refund stating he could do it better. I contacted support and they agreed to give me my money, cancel the order and investigate his account.

3. Buyer placed and order, I complete it, he then tells me that it’s incomplete because he wants additional work that was not included in the package he ordered. I informed him of this and also told him that nothing had been communicate with me ahead of time regarding his request. He got angry and asked for a refund.

4. This cancellation was the only one I till take partial fault. Buyer placed the order and everything seemed fine. I performed the work delivered it. The buyer essentially came back with a books worth of notes on how I should do every aspect of my job as well as suggesting I start over and change my workflow. I ultimately decided this client was going to be problematic and the order was going to warrant a huge time investment that wasn’t worth what he was paying me. I just figured it was best to save both parties time and move on.

I’ve told friends this, it’s been a really unlucky month for me in that I’ve had more bad clients in this one month than my entire first year on fiverr. And for that string of bad luck I’m basically going to have my account severely downgraded for 3 months.

[miiila]

The issue is the discrepancy between the rolling 60 day rating metric, and the 30 day evaluation period. It’s a guaranteed double demotion basically. No cancellations will get phased out before the 2nd evaluation, and as I stated before the math doesn’t work out in favor of a seller being able to dig themselves out of the ditch once they are in it. It’s a rigged system that guarantees you drop to new seller which doesn’t make any sense that such a severe penalty would be enacted.

Likely I’m going to contact support and ask they at least don’t count the 2 orders that customer service had to cancel on my behalf because of combative buyers who refused to work with and accept an order that was rendered as described. They took my side on those issues so I don’t see how I should be penalized for those. Having those 2 removed would put me back in good standing.

Well, I still think the issue isn’t the 30/60 days but cancellations that shouldn’t count against the seller counting against the seller.

[arty182925]

Well, I still think the issue isn’t the 30/60 days but cancellations that shouldn’t count against the seller counting against the seller.

I agree with you. Cancellations that aren’t sellers fault at all, shouldn’t be counted.

Example, got an order today to do assignments, needed to cancel. Another order is that buyer ordered less word count then they should… Probably another cancellation for this…

[mattvopro]

you are 34 days away from being 100% correct…

[developershakir]

Absolutely agree.“Buyer is always right”.

[levente_gl]

Absolutely agree.“Buyer is always right”.

Absolutely agree.“Buyer is always right”.

H*ck no! When they aren’t right, I don’t do anything but telling them why they aren’t right. so I don’t do revision/s and I don’t give refund at all. On the other hand, if they’re right, I won’t dispute it for a second.