Let us decide- Cancellation

[avrimusic]

What do to think about the option that seller can add to as a part of out gig term cancellation option switch on/off . the buyer will decide if he wants to order from that seller as a part of him gig term ,and the only option to cancel order with cancellation switch on with The CS is just if the seller is a scammer.

[nikavoice]

What do to think about the option that seller can add to as a part of out gig term cancellation option switch on/off . the buyer will decide if he wants to order from that seller as a part of him gig term ,and the only option to cancel order with cancellation switch on with The CS is just if the seller is a scammer.

Hey, Avri!

So, to clarify…

Sellers should have an option to use a toggle (on/off) button; if they allow cancellations or not, correct?

If the Seller allows cancellations, then it makes the cancellation process easier?

This part I’m confused. :thinking:

The CS is just if the seller is a scammer.

Sorry, I just woke up, so my eyes 👀

[vira_lanka19871]

I would suggest sellers could have more control over orders such as…

1. More cancellation reason selections including a " other " option.

2. A fixed time limit for buyers to request cancellation. ( sometimes buyers request refunds and cancellations even after a work is delivered and completed where many sellers had spent lots of time and resources on getting that specific order done.) And this will most probably limit or avoid this kind of situations.

3. If cancellation is un avoidable, give sellers options for full and partial refunds within the resolution center.

[avrimusic]

Hey, Avri!

So, to clarify…

Sellers should have an option to use a toggle (on/off) button; if they allow cancellations or not, correct?

If the Seller allows cancellations, then it makes the cancellation process easier?

This part I’m confused. :thinking:

The CS is just if the seller is a scammer.

Sorry, I just woke up, so my eyes 👀

Hi, the thing is that we as seller can decide if we offer cancellation as part of our gig terms. If we offer them, there is no point in involving CS and the cancellation will be between the buyer and the seller only. The CS will not be able to cancel our order unless the seller is a scammer (and there is proof about it). That’s the same if the buyer is a scammer (such as uses stolen credit card and such)

That gives the seller more power and reassure for their work and the buyer the more option to decide whether to work with that specific seller or not . The option for the cancellation will be visible to all.

[avrimusic]

I would suggest sellers could have more control over orders such as…

1. More cancellation reason selections including a " other " option.

2. A fixed time limit for buyers to request cancellation. ( sometimes buyers request refunds and cancellations even after a work is delivered and completed where many sellers had spent lots of time and resources on getting that specific order done.) And this will most probably limit or avoid this kind of situations.

3. If cancellation is un avoidable, give sellers options for full and partial refunds within the resolution center.

• A fixed time limit for buyers to request cancellation. ( sometimes buyers request refunds and cancellations even after a work is delivered and completed where many sellers had spent lots of time and resources on getting that specific order done.) And this will most probably limit or avoid this kind of situations.

• If cancellation is un avoidable, give sellers options for full and partial refunds within the resolution center.

I think you have a point there’ I would combine the two if they won’t accept my option:

The buyer can cancel the order before the order has been delivered and get a full refund or if the order has already been delivered, get a partial refund, such as 50% that the rest goes to the seller.

The thing is that the seller would really have the power and option to decide, we provide the service yet our work could be granted for free if the buyer receive the work and CS cancel the order and gives the buyer a refund.

[woofy31]

Hi, the thing is that we as seller can decide if we offer cancellation as part of our gig terms. If we offer them, there is no point in involving CS and the cancellation will be between the buyer and the seller only. The CS will not be able to cancel our order unless the seller is a scammer (and there is proof about it). That’s the same if the buyer is a scammer (such as uses stolen credit card and such)

That gives the seller more power and reassure for their work and the buyer the more option to decide whether to work with that specific seller or not . The option for the cancellation will be visible to all.

decide if we offer cancellation as part of our gig terms

There is no decision possible as long as buyers can still initiate a chargeback and forcefully get their money without Fiverr’s approval. Chargebacks are done no matter what Fiverr says or does.

That gives the seller more power

There is no power over buyer chargebacks - nobody can control those 😕

get a partial refund

And what’s to stop the buyer to take the partial refund and then initiate a chargeback for the rest of the money to get it all back? Nothing. They have control over their money, so we can’t have such power over their money.

---

To some buyers, forced chargebacks are their be-all and end-all. No matter how Fiverr designs the site, what options it offers or not, chargebacks are the ‘uncontrollable’ factor here, like a natural disaster that can strike at any moment 😐 Only thing would be for Fiverr to allow some sort of insurance for these ‘natural disasters’ especially since the co-founder seems to have created an insurance platform already (apparently, once in a while Fiverr does offer sellers a refund for buyer-initiated chargebacks, depending on the case)

[ydrawing]

I would suggest sellers could have more control over orders such as…

1. More cancellation reason selections including a " other " option.

2. A fixed time limit for buyers to request cancellation. ( sometimes buyers request refunds and cancellations even after a work is delivered and completed where many sellers had spent lots of time and resources on getting that specific order done.) And this will most probably limit or avoid this kind of situations.

3. If cancellation is un avoidable, give sellers options for full and partial refunds within the resolution center.

• A fixed time limit for buyers to request cancellation. ( sometimes buyers request refunds and cancellations even after a work is delivered and completed where many sellers had spent lots of time and resources on getting that specific order done.) And this will most probably limit or avoid this kind of situations.

This is a good thing. I make them aware that if they don’t come on time with the revisions within 3 days and the order is marked as complete, I will not grant those free revisions. In the past I used to grant them after weeks, because they had some excuse like ‘I was in vacation’… My policy is ‘If I can deliver on time, you should be able to come back with the revisions on time’.

[vira_lanka19871]

• A fixed time limit for buyers to request cancellation. ( sometimes buyers request refunds and cancellations even after a work is delivered and completed where many sellers had spent lots of time and resources on getting that specific order done.) And this will most probably limit or avoid this kind of situations.

This is a good thing. I make them aware that if they don’t come on time with the revisions within 3 days and the order is marked as complete, I will not grant those free revisions. In the past I used to grant them after weeks, because they had some excuse like ‘I was in vacation’… My policy is ‘If I can deliver on time, you should be able to come back with the revisions on time’.

100% agreed on this!

[avrimusic]

decide if we offer cancellation as part of our gig terms

There is no decision possible as long as buyers can still initiate a chargeback and forcefully get their money without Fiverr’s approval. Chargebacks are done no matter what Fiverr says or does.

That gives the seller more power

There is no power over buyer chargebacks - nobody can control those 😕

get a partial refund

And what’s to stop the buyer to take the partial refund and then initiate a chargeback for the rest of the money to get it all back? Nothing. They have control over their money, so we can’t have such power over their money.

---

To some buyers, forced chargebacks are their be-all and end-all. No matter how Fiverr designs the site, what options it offers or not, chargebacks are the ‘uncontrollable’ factor here, like a natural disaster that can strike at any moment 😐 Only thing would be for Fiverr to allow some sort of insurance for these ‘natural disasters’ especially since the co-founder seems to have created an insurance platform already (apparently, once in a while Fiverr does offer sellers a refund for buyer-initiated chargebacks, depending on the case)

I understand what you’re saying, but I’m talking about the things that Fiverr can do within their limits. As for now, sellers have almost none to zero “back” from Fiverr. Even if the seller is right, even if the seller did nothing wrong. It’s just opens a lot more headache for us all.

Just saying.

[avrimusic]

• A fixed time limit for buyers to request cancellation. ( sometimes buyers request refunds and cancellations even after a work is delivered and completed where many sellers had spent lots of time and resources on getting that specific order done.) And this will most probably limit or avoid this kind of situations.

This is a good thing. I make them aware that if they don’t come on time with the revisions within 3 days and the order is marked as complete, I will not grant those free revisions. In the past I used to grant them after weeks, because they had some excuse like ‘I was in vacation’… My policy is ‘If I can deliver on time, you should be able to come back with the revisions on time’.

I agree. but CS won’t. The buyer has the ultimate power over you. The buyer can ask a refund even after the order is marked as complete and the CS would tell that they can’t force a buyer to accept your delivery.

That’s the problem.

You’re doing what’s good for you and what works best and there’s nothing wrong with that- from seller point of view. But that ends here. Buyers will get their money back (dare I say always?).

[cyaxrex]

I agree that sellers should be allowed to decide whether or not they offer cancellations.

From experience, cancellation requests start coming in waves after one event, as buyers who know they can get away with cancelling, reorder and/or create new Fiverr accounts and order that way. Make life too difficult for them and they don’t bother.

Given the above, I would much rather have a buyer leave a bad review rather than run with their work and money.

Sadly, it seems to be easier than ever for buyers to have orders cancelled by CS just because they are unhappy.

On another note, chargebacks could be easily reduced by insisting that new buyers sign up with an email that matches their PayPal email address. If it doesn’t, don’t let them make purchases.

Of course, in the event of a chargeback, Fiverr wouldn’t likely be able to recover funds. However, this would make it much more difficult for scammer buyers to sign up with user names like bojangles2536, joblogs656876, and buyerx52322, over and over, without also going through the hassle of setting up and verifying new PayPal accounts for each Fiverr identity.

[avrimusic]

I agree that sellers should be allowed to decide whether or not they offer cancellations.

From experience, cancellation requests start coming in waves after one event, as buyers who know they can get away with cancelling, reorder and/or create new Fiverr accounts and order that way. Make life too difficult for them and they don’t bother.

Given the above, I would much rather have a buyer leave a bad review rather than run with their work and money.

Sadly, it seems to be easier than ever for buyers to have orders cancelled by CS just because they are unhappy.

On another note, chargebacks could be easily reduced by insisting that new buyers sign up with an email that matches their PayPal email address. If it doesn’t, don’t let them make purchases.

Of course, in the event of a chargeback, Fiverr wouldn’t likely be able to recover funds. However, this would make it much more difficult for scammer buyers to sign up with user names like bojangles2536, joblogs656876, and buyerx52322, over and over, without also going through the hassle of setting up and verifying new PayPal accounts for each Fiverr identity.

Given the above, I would much rather have a buyer leave a bad review rather than run with their work and money.

Agreed. But they can also leave a bad review and get their money back since Fiverr leaves reviews as they are and don’t delete them anymore.

Sadly, it seems to be easier than ever for buyers to have orders cancelled by CS just because they are unhappy.

Or just because they figured out a way they can get their delivery for free…

insisting that new buyers sign up with an email that matches their PayPal email address. If it doesn’t, don’t let them make purchases.

I don’t know if they can do that.

[ydrawing]

I agree. but CS won’t. The buyer has the ultimate power over you. The buyer can ask a refund even after the order is marked as complete and the CS would tell that they can’t force a buyer to accept your delivery.

That’s the problem.

You’re doing what’s good for you and what works best and there’s nothing wrong with that- from seller point of view. But that ends here. Buyers will get their money back (dare I say always?).

The buyer can ask a refund even after the order is marked as complete and the CS would tell that they can’t force a buyer to accept your delivery.

As far as I know, they can only request a refund in the first 40 days. In the 4 years I’ve been here I got only one ‘forced canceled’ order… There was a fast deliver order and I was late like 2h and the buyer only requested the money for the ‘fast delivery’. But I guess those who use paypal can request the chargerback in the first 90 days, if I’m not wrong…so that really sucks.

However, this would make it much more difficult for scammer buyers to sign up with user names like bojangles2536, joblogs656876, and buyerx52322, over and over, without also going through the hassle of setting up and verifying new PayPal accounts for each Fiverr identity.

We really need a verification system based on your ID card, for seller and buyers as well…This way the number of scammers will be brought down significantly.

[avrimusic]

The buyer can ask a refund even after the order is marked as complete and the CS would tell that they can’t force a buyer to accept your delivery.

As far as I know, they can only request a refund in the first 40 days. In the 4 years I’ve been here I got only one ‘forced canceled’ order… There was a fast deliver order and I was late like 2h and the buyer only requested the money for the ‘fast delivery’. But I guess those who use paypal can request the chargerback in the first 90 days, if I’m not wrong…so that really sucks.

However, this would make it much more difficult for scammer buyers to sign up with user names like bojangles2536, joblogs656876, and buyerx52322, over and over, without also going through the hassle of setting up and verifying new PayPal accounts for each Fiverr identity.

We really need a verification system based on your ID card, for seller and buyers as well…This way the number of scammers will be brought down significantly.

Verification system would be great, but I don’t think it would change the fact that buyers can ask cancellation all time no matter the circumstances.

[cyaxrex]

The buyer can ask a refund even after the order is marked as complete and the CS would tell that they can’t force a buyer to accept your delivery.

As far as I know, they can only request a refund in the first 40 days. In the 4 years I’ve been here I got only one ‘forced canceled’ order… There was a fast deliver order and I was late like 2h and the buyer only requested the money for the ‘fast delivery’. But I guess those who use paypal can request the chargerback in the first 90 days, if I’m not wrong…so that really sucks.

However, this would make it much more difficult for scammer buyers to sign up with user names like bojangles2536, joblogs656876, and buyerx52322, over and over, without also going through the hassle of setting up and verifying new PayPal accounts for each Fiverr identity.

We really need a verification system based on your ID card, for seller and buyers as well…This way the number of scammers will be brought down significantly.

We really need a verification system based on your ID card, for seller and buyers as well…This way the number of scammers will be brought down significantly.

There’s no way I’m giving my ID details to a company which cant fix basic bugs in its website for several years, and does not appear to be compliant with certain regional laws concerning copyright and management of personal information in the first place.

Switching to an Escrow based payment system would fix chargebacks once and for all, without any need for mass data collection.

[ydrawing]

We really need a verification system based on your ID card, for seller and buyers as well…This way the number of scammers will be brought down significantly.

There’s no way I’m giving my ID details to a company which cant fix basic bugs in its website for several years, and does not appear to be compliant with certain regional laws concerning copyright and management of personal information in the first place.

Switching to an Escrow based payment system would fix chargebacks once and for all, without any need for mass data collection.

There’s no way I’m giving my ID details to a company which cant fix basic bugs in its website for several years

seems fair enough. :))

[nikavoice]

Hi, the thing is that we as seller can decide if we offer cancellation as part of our gig terms. If we offer them, there is no point in involving CS and the cancellation will be between the buyer and the seller only. The CS will not be able to cancel our order unless the seller is a scammer (and there is proof about it). That’s the same if the buyer is a scammer (such as uses stolen credit card and such)

That gives the seller more power and reassure for their work and the buyer the more option to decide whether to work with that specific seller or not . The option for the cancellation will be visible to all.

Hi, the thing is that we as seller can decide if we offer cancellation as part of our gig terms. If we offer them, there is no point in involving CS and the cancellation will be between the buyer and the seller only. The CS will not be able to cancel our order unless the seller is a scammer (and there is proof about it). That’s the same if the buyer is a scammer (such as uses stolen credit card and such)

That gives the seller more power and reassure for their work and the buyer the more option to decide whether to work with that specific seller or not . The option for the cancellation will be visible to all.

Avri,

Thanks for the clarification.

I definitely see where you’re going with this. But wouldn’t it defeat the purpose since Fiverr has a cancellation policy in place? So, this idea seems like it would just muddy up the water. 😬

[avrimusic]

Hi, the thing is that we as seller can decide if we offer cancellation as part of our gig terms. If we offer them, there is no point in involving CS and the cancellation will be between the buyer and the seller only. The CS will not be able to cancel our order unless the seller is a scammer (and there is proof about it). That’s the same if the buyer is a scammer (such as uses stolen credit card and such)

That gives the seller more power and reassure for their work and the buyer the more option to decide whether to work with that specific seller or not . The option for the cancellation will be visible to all.

Avri,

Thanks for the clarification.

I definitely see where you’re going with this. But wouldn’t it defeat the purpose since Fiverr has a cancellation policy in place? So, this idea seems like it would just muddy up the water. 😬

Maybe it’s just me but policies can be changed…

In the spirit of all the other changes that goes on in this site, one that would effects us sellers in a good way would be great.

[webdevelopers90]

I will suggest you one thing that there must be a an option for the seller to accept the or declined the order so avoid the cancellation ratio,

[avrimusic]

I will suggest you one thing that there must be a an option for the seller to accept the or declined the order so avoid the cancellation ratio,

The problem is that you kinda have it right now cause you can agree or decline to order cancellation in the resolution center.

But once it’s goes to CS, you will “lose” it either way.

[webdevelopers90]

The problem is that you kinda have it right now cause you can agree or decline to order cancellation in the resolution center.

But once it’s goes to CS, you will “lose” it either way.

You are right we can cancel it the resolution center…

if we agree to cancel it then it will increase the cancellation ratio,

if we declined the cancellation then buyer live a bad and negative feedback,

[socialhonor]

Can anyone with any technical insight provide some perspective as to why – if fiverr CS recognizes that not all cancellations are the seller’s fault – such as “I ordered by mistake” - why they would not fix that absolutely unfair FLAW expeditiously?

I’m asking for a technical perspective… would it be hard to incorporate something to recognize “mistake” and override them - on the technical/website end?

The idea that any team decided that holding seller’s responsible when buyer’s order by mistake, in the first place… is hard to grasp… but to “prolong the pain” so to speak, causing GOOD sellers to be demoted, interfering with their income etc… is actually outrageous.

[mariokluser]

Scammers will get their money back, no matter how many buttons, blows and whistles you throw into the game.

[avrimusic]

You are right we can cancel it the resolution center…

if we agree to cancel it then it will increase the cancellation ratio,

if we declined the cancellation then buyer live a bad and negative feedback,

And will still can get is money back and our work for free.

This is what I’m trying to prevent

[avrimusic]

Can anyone with any technical insight provide some perspective as to why – if fiverr CS recognizes that not all cancellations are the seller’s fault – such as “I ordered by mistake” - why they would not fix that absolutely unfair FLAW expeditiously?

I’m asking for a technical perspective… would it be hard to incorporate something to recognize “mistake” and override them - on the technical/website end?

The idea that any team decided that holding seller’s responsible when buyer’s order by mistake, in the first place… is hard to grasp… but to “prolong the pain” so to speak, causing GOOD sellers to be demoted, interfering with their income etc… is actually outrageous.

I think the point is that they don’t want any cancellation and for you as a seller do whatever it takes to keep the order going. That’s even if you would do a 100$ job for 5$ and who knows how many revisions.

I don’t know the technologic point of view for it but I’m sure if there’s a will there’s a way.