Reply to @sincere18: I don’t need to Google it, I have been doing it for 30 years. Let me give you another example, If I record a ringtone or files for sale in an app, do you think I will let them have that for a few dollars? No they would need to buy out the copyright, absolutely not the same as usage or licensing.
What kind of gig are you buying?
What does it matter?
Reply to @hencook: BEcause while it says in Fiverr that technically once a buyer has a gig deliivered, that the rights then go to the buyer. HOwever, some sellers may want to keep the rights or thing they keep the rights, so I was curious what kind of gig, because some gigs have more value to the seller than others.
No the buyer does not have all rights when delivered, they have right of usage and that is what the commercial gig is for. Think of a hire car you can pay for usage but don’t own the car. Same as digital work, unless the work is subject to a buyout the commercial use covers usage not ownership.
Reply to @sincere18: Nah, I think Fiverr just loves money and someone on staff thinks it’s brilliant which spurred it into motion. Especially since they rolled it out inefficiently and with little explanation. But, either way, I agree that it’s going to get talked about! I’ve already seen several threads on it.
They’re voice over gigs btw.
Now I’m even more confused. Why is there an option to buy multiple commercial use licenses? Does it suggest that you’d have to have a license for every single individual gig you buy? It’s pretty insane because all these voice-over artists are adding on $10 or $20 commercial use licenses to their $5 gig, imagine how all of the voice-over artists on the site made themselves completely unaffordable to smaller businesses like me because of this commercial license confusion.
Fiverr implemented this change automatically. Some of the voice over artist might not have seen the change made in their profiles. They still have the option to inactivate it. Fiverr chose the price based on their gig performance. Maybe you can talk to your artist and see if it is mandatory since your budget is tight.
Reply to @stuartjsmith: That’s not how “work for hire” works. You can google that and read more about it.
Reply to @hencook: I think Fiverr is adding those automatically.
And yes, every piece of art you buy that you want to use commercially needs it’s own license.
Also, paying $15 for a voice over for a business doesn’t seem that unreasonable. In the real world a voice over gig would cost a few hundred bucks.
"Ownership and limitations: Unless clearly stated otherwise on the sellers Gig page/description, when the work is delivered, and subject to payment, the buyer is granted all intellectual property rights, including but not limited to, copyrights for the work delivered from the seller, and the seller waives any and all moral rights therein.
Some Gigs (including for custom created work) charge additional payments (through Gig Extras) for a Commercial Use License. This means that if you purchase the Gig for personal use, you will own all rights you require for such use, and will not need the Commercial Use License. If you intend to use it for any charge or other consideration, or for any purpose that is directly or indirectly in connection with any business, or other undertaking intended for profit, you will need to buy the Commercial Use License through a Gig Extra and will have broader rights that cover your business use."
Personal use, no. Business use, yes. If you still need any legal clarification, it’s best to contact Fiverr Customer Service.
No you don’t own all rights, there is a very clear difference between “Usage” and “Copyright” what you are paying for is usage NOT copyright. Same as downloading a music file, you may have purchased it but that does not mean you own the copyright. Copyright and usage are two completely different things.
The thing that’s making me scratch my head is that it doesn’t make sense.
Let’s say I ignore the commercial use license, and a voice actor takes me to court. What can the voice actor even argue? He didn’t grant me a commercial use license, but why would I need one if I’m the one that holds all the rights for it? What right does the voice actor even have to give me a commercial license?
Reply to @stuartjsmith: Actually, on Fiverr, it doesn’t matter what you’ve done for 30 years or what you would or would not do if you were selling something elsewhere. All that matters is what the Fiverr Terms of Service says about buying the copyright. It was already mentioned in the thread but perhaps you missed it, so in case, the Fiverr Terms of Service does say “Unless clearly stated otherwise on the sellers Gig page/description, when the work is delivered, and subject to payment, the buyer is granted all intellectual property rights, including but not limited to, copyrights for the work delivered from the seller” so on gigs where there is no other mention of license or rights, the buyer does indeed get all rights as stated.
The Commercial License fee changes things on gigs where it exists, or on gigs where the seller decides to clearly state up front that they are NOT selling all rights in the base gig. Some people would say it is smarter for sellers to charge extra for those rights. Some buyers will be fine with paying extra for them. For buyers that don’t want to pay extra, they can look for a gig that doesn’t charge extra.
The only point is that you are incorrect in saying that on Fiverr
stuartjsmith said: the buyer does not have all rights when deliveredsince the ToS explicitly says they do if nothing else is stated. The reason I want to make this clear is that when you say things that aren't correct, new buyers and sellers may be confused by that.
Reply to @stuartjsmith: Could you please explain why the Fiverr Terms of Service doesn’t apply since we are talking about sales on Fiverr, not sales elsewhere? Copyright and usage are different, that is correct. Again, the Fiverr ToS clearly says the buyer is granted all “copyrights” unless the seller clearly states otherwise.
Reply to @hencook: Technically the ToS doesn’t say you have all rights in all cases. You only have all rights if the seller doesn’t mention an extra fee for rights. The voice actor has the right to give you a commercial license because you are buying property from that person.
If you ignored the commercial license, the seller would have to know that you used the property commercially, file some type of claim against you and defend that claim. In many cases sellers don’t even know the real identities of buyers. A claim could come in the form of a lawsuit as you said, or there other actions they could take depending on where you use the "property."
To be honest, I find it quite doubtful that most sellers would follow up on any of that as long as they got paid for the gig and received an excellent review. That is kind of the “elephant” in the copyright room. Perhaps they would if it happened to be a high-paying gig involving a substantial amount of work. Since the special “Commercial License” extra is very new on Fiverr as it exists now, I doubt any precedent has been set.
For sure, I won’t order from sellers who use this licence cr*p. It’s just another attempt from Fiverr to squeeze more money out of people.
Meh, they’re not forced to use it, and we can always ask them not to, I’m probably just seething from the backlash of these terms, hehe.
The whole license thing is really a case by case basis. Anyone who has the spare cash to get other people to do things for their personal amusement proooobably has just as enough cash as the next business trying to get by. If you’re charging more for a commercial license for software, that makes sense. If you’re charging more for a commercial license like contract work? Ehhh it’s only going to get more competitive from here.
sincere18 said: Also, paying $15 for a voice over for a business doesn't seem that unreasonable. In the real world a voice over gig would cost a few hundred bucks.
Indeed the real world would cost a lot, but there are online alternatives that are quickly becoming more attractive. I'm just sad that I may have to leave who I was working with.
Reply to @fonthaunt: Yes happy to, nobody can override your copyright and why “unless stated on gig” is in the T&C’s. Countries like the UK USA and many others are signed up to the Berne Convention which covers artists at point of creation and that is where copyright exists when saved in a known format. Nobody can override that unless there is a contract between two parties, the artist always retains control and why it is best practice to add a couple of lines to your gigs. The key thing for me is reproduction rights, I would never give up mine as an artist. In simplistic terms a buyer can order a gig for a few dollars and then makes millions from a video, app etc. One of the biggest things that trips artists up is giving complete rights to buyers and being taken advantage of. Don’t get me wrong buy outs of contracts happen all the time and I have signed thousands over the years, but I got burnt once when I recorded celebrity voicemails and ringtones many years ago and they went on to make tens of thousands. I learnt then that you never give up your reproduction rights, not with apps and many other platforms or we just add to the long line of skint artists that are taken advantage of. I have products online that I own and retain copyright which earn a steady stream of money, it’s just good practice as I want to earn a decent living. I would like to point our Fiverr are doing nothing wrong, they are the selling platform and the commercial licence is a good thing, but it is up to sellers to protect themselves and why I add the lines on my gigs “Commercial Usage is granted for any promotion, business or other commercial use. This does not include reproduction rights and Copyright is retained by seller” I am here to help artists and pass on my experience, don’t be another broke artist who struggles to make a living, protect yourselves.