Here’s how the discussion began:
HE WRITES: Hi. We are starting a new business and seeking a name and tagline. We already have a few ideas but nothing blows us away. As I can’t seem to locate the information on the site, I was wondering if you can tell me prior to engagement how fiverr and its sellers treat intellectual property (business ideas and concepts) without NDA’s…?
I WRITE: The names you buy from me become your property, I will not even give them to someone else. However, I do not sign NDA’s because that violates Fiverr’s rules about confidentiality.
Here’s what you can share, if you have a website and I need it to see what you do, you can share that. It’s just e-mails and phone numbers you’re not allowed to share, and even if you did, I wouldn’t bother calling.
What I want is simple instructions, then I do the job.
HE WRITES: Ok. But what I meant was: I need to disclose a business concept to you in order to give you the best information from which you would create a name and tagline, and I wish to protect that business concept as my intellectual property.
How do you / fiverr typically handle this issue?
I WRITE: Listen, I’m just a copywriter, I don’t make cash by stealing other people’s concepts and making them my own. I don’t have the time, energy, or the desire to do that. Besides, you don’t have to explain to me the entire idea if you’re scared. I just need something simple, like “Hi, I have a military-themed restaurant where the waiters dress like soldiers.” See? It’s not so hard.
HE WRITES: Listen, I’m just an ex-potential customer who doesn’t like being spoken to condescendingly.
And I am an ex-potential customer who literally needs over 100 products named. Hence my interest in seeking out a creative, and easy to work with, collaborator on fiverr.
If you have ever run your own business beyond revenues obtained in $5 increments, you would understand the importance of establishing, even at minimum – and in lieu of any legal document – a sense of trust / relationship with any vendor prior to putting a unique and viable business concept out to strangers via the internet.
All you had to do was to acknowledge your understanding of a potential client’s misgivings. Instead, Simon, you got cocky.
Sorry it didn’t work out.
So where was my condescension? Was it the “See? It’s not so hard”?
Sometimes I don’t know why I bother answering questions.
Here’s how the discussion began:
Reply to @infinityplusone: Thanks for the tip.
Reply to @itsyourthing: Thanks for the advice.
What do you think about my gig description?
Is this line too harsh?
"Please note I do not sign non-disclosure agreements, so don’t bother asking.
Please don’t message me with questions like “hi, do you write brand names?” or “what do I need to order this?” This is not a logo gig either. I’m a WRITER, not a designer. "
I’m trying to prevent drama.
Condescending is the wrong word. The buyer was playing games, he was trying to get into legalities and what not, and i don’t think he even knew what he was asking you. Basically he wanted to know would you tell his revolutionary business concept. And you let him know this is not what you spend your time doing. Then he tries to insult you for how much you charge, when he was going to pay you that same amount indeed. The guy sounds like a loser and you should be glad not to work with unprofessional buyers like that. I wish sellers could charge buyers a fee for having to speak with them. For the most part, i don’t even entertain a lot of back and forth messaging unless you actually become a buyer and have made a purchase. such a waste.
This is too harsh; “so don’t bother asking.” Another unnecessary ending to a sentence which sounds irritable. I wouldn’t want to deal with someone who talked that way if I were looking for someone to hire. I like you very much and understand how you feel though.
Can’t do what you can’t do. Fiverr won’t let us sign NDAs, like you said.
I try to keep my gigs as simple as possible now. I pass on all orders where the instructions are poor. I pass on all orders when the buyer asks for something outside the service I offer. There’s plenty more people out there happy to work with me on my terms.
I think you just did what you had to do. You’ve got to know the service you offer, and let people figure out if that’s for them. That’s what you did with this guy. If that comes across as arrogance or condescension, it’s just because we do this stuff all day every day and have learnt to become kind of robotic about it. We just wanna get on with work. You can go on for hours and hours with some buyers.
Maybe you had a lucky escape. Sure he said he’d order bulk, but what happens if someone releases a similar business to him, he’s gonna be on your ass thinking it’s you. Dunno about you man, but I don’t include stress in my gig prices.
Reply to @sara1984: I agree with you, I also try to keep it simple. In fact, I don’t mind if people give me short instructions, but this I mind:
"Hello i search whoever can write a spot of radio for my coffee shop. "
Then she writes again:
"Can you help me?
How much is it?"
The name of that gig is “I will write a radio commercial for $5.” Seriously, it’s like some people don’t think. I wonder if they show up at McDonald s and say, “hi, do you sell cheeseburgers?”
I will answer your question. I can see how he thought that.
I too am often tempted to write exactly what I think but I put effort into being very careful about the phrases I use when I communicate here.
This: “See? It’s not so hard.” and this: "and even if you did, I wouldn’t bother calling."
Those phrases are not needed and seem a little touchy.
True, some people don’t think, but we have to pretend we are not as irritated with them as we actually are in the name of customer relations.
Reply to @misscrystal:
I totally agree. When I was reading the conversation, I got the impression that the potential buyer was professional, but the seller’s answers were not on that level.
WHAT is said is always important, but HOW it’s said is as much important. I don’t see anything wrong about what the seller answered, but if I were the potential customer, I would pass on this gig, too.
Reply to @misscrystal: Yeah, I can see how “it’s not so hard” might sound condescending. But honestly, I do resent this ridiculous obsession with non-disclosures agreements. Seriously, this people act like I’m interviewing for a job with the CIA or the Secret Service. Who do they think I am? Edward Snowden?
I mean, if they’re such big shots why hire people on Fiverr? Why not hire some expensive company that’s gonna charge them $1,000 to $10,000 and sign all the papers they need? Sorry, I get frustrated.
I don’t know if condescending is the right word but your communication that starts “I WRITE: Listen, I’m…” does come across as if you are annoyed at the buyer.
I can relate to being paranoid that someone might try to steal what in your own mind is a million dollar idea as I have been an entrepreneur and had big ideas and they do get stolen sometimes so it’s not all that farfetched. You don’t know who to trust with your idea. I think he just wanted some reassurance which you gave him albeit in an irritated tone.
Reply to @customrapsongs: Thanks CustomRapSongs, that’s how I see it, I just wanted to make sure. The irony is that when I was writing my answers, I thought I was being nice and helpful. LOL
I completely understand where you were coming from. How do you explain to someone that you work with so many businesses every day and couldn’t care less about stealing the concept? I don’t even know how to phrase that. In regard to your question, there were two comments that stood out: “even if you did, I wouldn’t bother calling” and "it’s not that hard."
Live and learn.
fastcopywriter said: when I was writing my answers, I thought I was being nice and helpful. LOL
HA, going off of that just to give you a quick story... yesterday, I worked on a script for a buyer who has a B&B. I had a difficult time writing the script because the website had absolutely no information about the B&B. It was 100% just about this man's life story. The design was DIY and just all over the place. The B&B itself looked amazing though and this business has so much potential.
Anyway, I managed to put a script together. Within the delivery, as a bonus, I thought I was doing a great thing by giving him some advice on the website. I suggested simple things like to add an address, create a business facebook page rather than linking to his own personal profile, and to add information about the B&B on the business website rather than entirely focusing on his story. I am a website expert and get paid to help people out with stuff like that so I thought I was being really nice. Anyway, he got upset about it. After reflecting on it, I can understand where he is coming. In my mind, I was genuinely trying to help. At the time I thought not saying anything at all would be comparable to seeing a woman with her dress tucked into her underwear and just walking by without saying a word. Communication errors are bound to happen working online.
Ever notice how someone looking to spend just $5 thinks he needs to exaggerate by saying you lost out on “hundreds of jobs” when they get upset? He sounds like a difficult person to work with and not worth the $5 to ahem $500+ he’d send your way.
Reply to @alliemadison12: You over delivered and he got upset. It’s a risk we take, most people will love you for over delivering, but a few are quite nasty about it. Thanks for sharing.
Reply to @alliemadison12: That’s the struggle, maybe I’m gonna update my gig description, let them know I don’t sign NDA’s.
Reply to @jtengle: True, some buyers aren’t difficult at first but then demand revisions forever. I’m even thinking about charging for revisions, what do you think of that as a gig extra?
Some buyers repeatedly insist they can’t see the files I send them.
One today kept saying it was not in blue like the other files I sent and he can’t click on them from his phone and has no computer access. I am not sure how to get files to these individuals. I send links which are uploaded and links on dropbox both, but either way some keep saying they can’t see them, or can’t click on them.
Everyone else can, so I have no idea what’s going on.